Summary:  This episode was written by Jenny Klein and directed by John Badham. The episode features the return of Travis Aaron Wade as Cole in a Monster of the Week episode that also features the return of a season 6 monster, the Worms of Eve!

The episode opens with a gruesome murder, a de-organing shall we say? We find Sam and Dean back at the bunker with Sam researching the Mark of Cain. Dean finds them a case and they head out to Fayetteville, North Carolina, a military town. During the drive, Dean admonishes Sam for keeping on the Cain case, saying that they need to accept and then do what they can until Dean can’t anymore.

The case involves the cold open murder and when they get there it seems the case is solved. They continue researching the case and find strange clues about returning military men with symptoms that are not particularly healthy. After leaving one house, Kit Vernon’s, they run into Cole. It turns out Cole is Kit’s best friend. Cole also has access to some intelligence about Kit’s last mission and it appears that something attacked the group during a rescue mission that failed. Later we see Kit in a gas station rampaging through it for water – one of the symptoms is extreme thirst. Kit ends up killing and runs off.

Dean and Sam drop Cole off at home but Cole won’t be left out of the investigation and makes his way to a lodge to find Kit. The boys get there in time to save Cole but not from being infected with the WORM OF EVE (trademark pending). Dean stays at the lodge with Cole and first tries to electrocute the worm out, as it worked in season 6, but this time it doesn’t. Given the symptom of extreme thirst, Dean decides to sweat it out. (Gratuitious sweat arm porn from Ackles commences here). At Kit’s house, Sam arrives just in time to save Jemma from her husband.

Dean and Cole share a nice emotional moment about Cole’s father and giving up. Cole asks to be tied to the chair so he doesn’t attack Dean for water, but then he does attack Dean. Dean pulls him through it. I’d like to give kudos here to Travis Aaron Wade. He does excellently in this scene when Cole thinks of himself as a monster. Jemma and Sam are trying to figure out Kit’s situation when Kit escapes and attacks Sam. Cole attacks Dean and then evacuates (the best word I got here folks) the worm.

Sam, unfortunately, had to kill Kit.

The episode ends with Cole talking to Sam and Dean and then leaving....and Sam lamenting that he couldn’t save this one. The scene is laden with meaning.

Questions:

Do you think Sam will give up his quest or keep it secret from Dean?

Do you think Dean means that he’s just given up on finding a cure?

Do you think Jemma/Kit signaled what will happen with Sam/Dean?

So what are your thoughts, reactions, feelings? Leave them here!

Comments  

SueB
# SueB 2015-03-18 23:18
I think Sam is panicked and is heading towards something really reckless. And yes, he'll keep it from Dean...because "drama".
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-19 00:30
''NO, WE ARE DONE PLAYING OPERATION''...............
MY DEANO IS BACK :):):):):D:D:D: D:D;);););):p
nicknicknicknick
# nicknicknicknick 2015-03-19 01:15
Really good and pretty freaky episode. I wish we'd learned a bit more about where these Kahn worms came from, and it would have been better if Sam had shown *some* resentment at Cole (please, don't use this as a jumping point for the oft-discussed 'Sam has no POV' arguments; we know, we know) :( ;) But all in all I thought it was a pretty tense and icky hour. Grade: B :)
nicknicknicknick
# nicknicknicknick 2015-03-19 01:15
Really good and pretty freaky episode. I wish we'd learned a bit more about where these Kahn worms came from, and it would have been better if Sam had shown *some* resentment at Cole (please, don't use this as a jumping point for the oft-discussed 'Sam has no POV' arguments; we know, we know) :( ;) But all in all I thought it was a pretty tense and icky hour. Grade: B :)
cheryl42
# cheryl42 2015-03-19 01:23
I liked it. One of the better stand alones. I liked Cole here too. Didn't really progress the MOC story very much but it kept my interest the whole episode.
Dean has a fatalistic outlook as per Dean
Sam is going to ignore Dean and continue searching for a cure
Cole hopefully will learn his lesson and stick with his family. Although I like his character the family is going to pose a problem for any recurring role. Please show don't kill his family.
It would have been poetic justice if Sam had been doing the electrocuting.
The episode didn't really set up much speculation for the future. Maybe next week.
LEAH
# LEAH 2015-03-19 06:26
I was thinking the EXACT same thing during the electrocution scene, Cheryl!
Dion7
# Dion7 2015-03-19 01:43
I really liked this episode. A fun and suspenseful motw episode with some foreboding for Sam. It's great to see them take a break from vampires, werewolves and ghosts and use one of the more rare monsters. I'm looking forward to finding out how this mark of Cain thing is going to unfold for the brothers. And it's nice to see Cole come to terms with Sam and Dean. I'm curious what Alice is going to say about it, she usually has interesting reviews.
Lilah_Kane
# Lilah_Kane 2015-03-19 02:29
I liked the episode but ewewewww! I don't like alien wormy stuff inside bodies. That is actually one thing that really creeps me out. Anyway, Stellar episode and I am with Cole for not wanting to see the Winchesters again because well, reasons. He survived so he shouldn't push his luck. :D

For MoC it was still there but more subtle. I think Sam will be not agreeing that he can't save Dean. Not saving everyone from Dean's lips turned mirroring that he can't save Dean and Sam is having none of it. I liked that they showed the victims here and they were all great. No teens! *coughcough*

- Lilah
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-19 03:36
You don't know how old the Khan Worm might be, you ageist you!!!
Lilah_Kane
# Lilah_Kane 2015-03-19 15:21
Butbutbut! Wait, now you have done it. Teen Khan worm is actually worst beast of the mutations if that would be so. Bad Aly BAD! ;)

And some teens have been good! (but never ever the worm one) :D

- Lilah
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 06:57
Yes, but you know as well as I do that Teen Khan Worms ARE the demographic that the CW is shooting for this season, so you can't lay that blame on me!!! Besides, they're so cute when they talk back to you, wiggling their little teen bodies so that they can turn their backs on you...muttering how clueless we adults are... Why, they're adorbs!!! I personally can't wait to see them come back! Maybe next season they can pair them with Krissy and her crew! Ok, I'll shut up now. Don't want to give our fearless writers any ideas... plus I'm making myself ill.
jamie
# jamie 2015-03-19 03:27
Up until the last few seconds I thought the moral of the MOTW story was going to be that if you keep fighting, you can beat the monster inside of you. With Dean's speech in the car at the beginning and Cole living while Kit died, it made sense to me. The "even when you do things right you sometimes can't save the guy" thing was out of left field for me. I guess this will be the catalyst for Sam deciding to try some of the "wrong" things to save Dean.

They keep hinting at how far will Sam go, but really is there anything these boys haven't done already that would really shock us?
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-19 03:50
No, the moral of the MOTW episode is make-sure-you-a ren't-wearing-y our-good-shoes- just-in-case-yo u-might-have-to -randomly-stomp -on-a-Khan Worm!!! Sheesh. How could you miss that? ;)

Seriously, I'm getting tired of all the anvils. We get it, we get it!!! So NOW can we have some serious progression on the MOC storyline, please!!!!! I still can't believe they wasted all that momentum from Cains episode to give us this. Any other time, fine. But Dean just killed THE FATHER OF MURDER and he's acting like he could be out for a Sunday drive. C'mon Carver!!! I'm starting to have bad acid flashbacks (and i never dropped acid so thats saying something) of the never ending Cas/Hanna road trip... enough with filler eps...
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-19 11:17
HEAR YE, HEAR YE !!!!!!!!!!:D
njspnfan
# njspnfan 2015-03-19 11:23
Carver has already said they're going to " accordion out" the storyline to accommodate Season 11 so be prepared for lots and lots of filler, with plenty of Dean-angst, and Sam either silently worrying or being choked and/or unconscious. :):)
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 07:02
If he's not careful he's going to "accordian out" a bunch of viewers soon... There's stretching a storyline or arc out and then there's boredom. He's dangerously treading that line. If he didn't have the superb talents of both of his lead actors to carry him... I hope he prays daily and realizes what a lucky, lucky man he is.
Jen
# Jen 2015-03-19 04:08
Sam will keep looking - He doesn't won't to loose his brother His face said it all And yes he won't tell Dean - On another WFB thread we spoke of Sam and witchcraft I reckon thats the answer :D:D
Yes Dean has given up on finding a cure He has said so many times - the disappointment in getting his hopes up is dragging him down As always he beleives its over for him and he wont's to go out fighting in S3 the same thing happened Dean couldn't get out of going to Hell He tried everything but excepted his fate
I really couldn't see a likeness in Gemma & Kits situation to Sam & Deans. Yes Gemma fought for her husband and Loved him but I beleive Sam won't let it happen may come close but NAH can't see it

I thought it was a good come back episode, the boys hunting a chatting together The intro of Cole was a good one The con worm has grown up since its last TV appearance LOL Could be a few new baddies like this turning up in Supernatural Land. They still arn't giving alot away. Sam at least seemed involved this time. I still can't work Sam out whether its what we have already discussed or {This is what I'm hoping} there settling him into the back ground and then something major is gonna come from it AND ALL WILL BE REVEALED yeah like that idea.
Russ
# Russ 2015-03-19 04:11
All in all, not a bad episode. Some of the conversations felt forced, or even unnecessary (when Sam closes the laptop hiding what he's looking for. Why does that need to be a secret? Faux-conflict malarkey).

Having said that, I really enjoyed the tone. The opening scene with the inverted hanging, and throat cutting, was a dark/horror side of Supernatural that has been missing for some time (4+ seasons). It was a welcome return. Hope it wasn't a one off.

Some have complained it was a slow burn after the previous episode, but I'm in the 0.1% that loathed the mid-season finale and think it was a steaming pile of honkin' horse shit. This episode felt more "Supernatural" than any episode this season.

Oh, and no Rowena/Crowley scenes? They can keep that going too :)

Solid B-.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 07:50
Just curious- by mid-season finale did you mean Executioners Song? and if so, why did you hate it? I liked it, but not as much as most fans seemed to.
Russ
# Russ 2015-03-21 10:56
Haha ... I'm trying to word a one line response eloquently, but all I keep coming back to is "it just f**king sucked!".

Yes I was referring to Executioner's Song.

It's why I didn't post anything in the episode's specific topics. Everyone was all "Squee!, the brothers hugged", I didn't want to piss on everybody's steps.

I'll start with the opening scene, before Cain shows up, we're treated to a non-engaging C-grade scene, with music befitting a Miami Vice parody YouTube video.

Throughout the reviews and comments of this episode, the music got a fair amount of praise, and I'm struggling to understand why. It wasn't good, and hasn't been for some time. A big fail for this show this season (and previous), is not just ill-fitting music, but scenes layered with music that would be better served without music at all. There were a good half a dozen scenes in the Executioner's Song that could have done without the musical backdrop, and the opening scene is one of them.

Timothy Omundson has a gravitational voice that you can't help but focus on. Smothering his voice with music the way they did took any chilling effect away from anything he said. It diminishes the effect of his words and actions. The actors might as well have done the scenes mute - but that would require talent on the director and editor's part, and that I have no faith in (and the music still would have sucked).

As for the rest of the episode? I could spend 3 weeks complaining and still not cover everything, so I'll keep the following few points short & sweet.

Rowena? Hands down the most out of synch and horribly acted character Supernatural has ever introduced. She sucks. Her story is bad. Her scenes are bad. The acting is very, very, bad. Every time she's on screen, I feel like I'm watching a deleted scene from Days of our Lives (over-acted Dark Basement edition). Terrible and talentless across the board.

The showdown between Cain and Dean? What can I say. I've seen more intense fights with the brothers against the lowest level of demons and monsters. The Father of Murder? Meh. Again ... shut the music off. It added nothing. Extended monologues aren't served well by a constant soundtrack. It only served as distraction from the poor direction and shot composition. If you want the words to mean something, turn the fucking music off!

Oh, and the Father of Murder being killed off-screen? What a crock of shit. Jeremy Carver can stick those sounds of thunder up his arse.

The following 140 seconds or so after the "epic battle" were the only notable moments in the episode worthy of any kudos. That's where the episode should have ended.

Then we get Days of Our Over-acted Dark Basement Lives again.

The final scene should have been the opening scene of the following episode.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-21 21:44
Wow, that was hilarious. I'm really glad you didn't whittle it down to one sentence. I do agree with several of your points: Rowena- terrible. Not showing Cain's death- ridiculous, unless he isn't really dead, but that would also be ridiculous. The fight scene- I didn't find it as exciting as everyone else because it looked less realistic than many other fight scenes, like the Sam/Dean death match in When the Levee Breaks. It wasn't even much of a fight until the last few seconds. But I liked the ep because Cain is a very compelling character (I loved your "gravitational voice" comment) and the plot actually moved forward in the ep. BTW, I love a bro-hug as much as the next gal, but I absolutely despise the word "squee" - who the hell invented it? So your "squee" comment was particularly funny. Thanks for responding to my question, and in such an entertaining way!
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-19 11:08
I always love and seek out your comments.
WELL DONE SIR :):):);)
njspnfan
# njspnfan 2015-03-19 07:42
A good MOTW episode; nice tone set with the opening scene of the hanging and bleeding the victim, and some genuinely creepy stuff this week. I think the director John Badham pulled an Alfred Hitchcock and inserted himself in one of the scenes. I wasn't sure why Dean just didn't start cramming salt down Cole's throat to dehydrate him; seems to me that would piss off a parasite that craved water/hydration .

A couple of minor complaints; Dean is showing absolutely no ill effects from the MoC/killing Cain so I guess that's going to be ignored for now. And some of the dialog was a little clunky but have resigned myself to the fact that most of the current writers have trouble finding the right tone with the brothers. I liked Cole but, for some reason, find his nicknames for Sam and Dean a little off-putting - not sure why that would bug me but it did.

Still don't understand why Sam would feel the need to hide the fact that he's researching the MoC; pretty sure Dean hasn't told Sam about what Cain told him, but I guess they need some contrived conflict. A bit heavy on the foreshadowing/a nvils this episode, too, with Sam upset he wasn't able to save Kit, Dean insisting that Cole fight it and save himself, the Khan worm driving it's hosts to murder when it didn't get what it craved (MoC / Dean / murder), and Sam and Dean's conversation at the end of the episode when Dean said sometimes you're not able to save them even when you do everything right, or something to that effect.


Do you think Sam will give up his quest or keep it secret from Dean?
No - Sam will continue looking; I suppose Sam will keep it a secret so we can have some contrived conflict.

Do you think Dean means that he’s just given up on finding a cure?
Yes, I think Dean has resigned himself to the fact that he'll need to live with this, but is still scared he may end up killing Sam and, at some point, will separate himself from Sam to "protect" him.

Do you think Jemma/Kit signaled what will happen with Sam/Dean?
Yes, a little heavy on the anvils but that's okay.
spnlit
# spnlit 2015-03-20 17:49
I agree with you, when Dean mentioned rapid dehydration, I expected him to pour salt down Cole's throat. I am also bothered by the lack of capitalization of the momentum from the last ep. Executioner's Song; Dean was clearly damaged and changed by his encounter with and killing of Cain. This should have been reflected in Dean's actions/ state of mind. In light of the brother's open discussions about the MOC, it does appear to be contrived conflict and a step back to have Dean in fatalistic acceptance mode and Sam hiding his research. I am hoping that Dean takes to heart his speech to Cole about not going down the not surviving road and the need to give it your all; but then again it may just be forgotten.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 08:11
I liked the episode and Cole. Although I found it ridiculous (but typical of these writers) that Cole kind of apologized for trying to kill Dean, who he thought was a murderer, but not for torturing an innocent Sam. But I liked Cole, the monster, and the story. I agree that the contrived "hiding the research" story is dumb, dumb, DUMB, but again, typical of these writers. For once, having Dean bond with the guest star while Sam is elsewhere made sense in the plot. Sam had to be the one to kill Kit so he could angst about not being able to save him, thus setting up the story for Sam going all out to save Dean. That last scene made it pretty clear that that is the direction the story is going and hopefully they won't wait until the final episode for things to happen. Although it seems a little forced that Sam would be that upset about having to kill Kit. It's kind of a regular Tuesday for the boys to have to kill monsters inhabiting innocent humans. Other little gripes: Dean is not stupid and his first step in the sweat it out process would have been to tie Cole up. I mean, DUH! Cole actually had to suggest it himself. And why wasn't Sam keeping an eye on Kit? Sure he was tied up, but the infected people showed extra strength so he could have escaped. Moreover, what if the worm had left his body while Sam wasn't looking? The Winchesters used to show a lot more smarts. Finally, Dean should be showing some effects from killing Cain! After Sam's ominous "Dean's in trouble" I was sure there would be some immediate fallout. But no, that would have the plot move forward far too fast apparently. Overall, I thought this was one of the better MOTW episodes we've seen in awhile and I hope we see Cole again. And I love the concept of "arm sweat porn".
E
# E 2015-03-19 08:59
I am surprised… I thought that this was a mediocre episode at best, but many here seemed to have liked it quite a bit. There was a nice, creepy tone and some pretty intense violence, but all in all there were far too many problems for me to overlook and call this one a "good" episode. C grade from me and IMO I'm being kind.

1. SILENT SAM: It seems that in the current show formula that the boys have a brotherly talk at the start and the end of each episode. Well, it appears that Sam doesn't even need to be present for those any more because Dean had the brotherly talk ALL BY HIMSELF…. and Sam sat there and said not one single word as Dean spouted his absolutely illogical and defeatist attitude AGAIN, because we haven't heard it in at least five minutes. Dean's attitude is dumb and completely nonsensical; so where is the Sam of seasons gone by who would have said so? would have argued? No, now all we get is silent Sam and I guess we must assume that he's not in agreement with Dean although you'd never know it by the way it was presented on screen. The camera didn't even zoom in on his face so that Jared could deliver one of his patented "I'm participating in this scene… watch my facial subtext as I silently disagree" moments. It was ludicrous.

2. HYPOCRITE DEAN: So, Dean tells Sam that he's not to keep looking for a cure (for NO reason btw) and he's just going to keep going "until he can't" at which point …..what Dean? What is the next step after "you can't?" Hmmmm? You're an unstoppable Demon, a Knight of Hell and no one can do anything about it because you told Sam to stop looking for a cure and there's no plan to deal with what you've become? That seems smart. Dean's entire attitude is so illogical that I basically roll my eyes every time he opens his mouth to deliver one of his stoic "I'm Doomed" speeches. You're only doomed Dean because you've quit. It's Stoic Dean 101 and it has no logical basis in reality for a POV, and yet the writers take on it is that Dean is somehow 'heroic' in his passive victim's approach. THEN, Dean feeds Cole the "you can't ever give up soldier!" crap that he doesn't even believe in for himself? Geez. I had hoped for about 1.2 seconds that Dean would have found a reason to keep fighting in Cole's perseverance, that would have been cool… Dean realizes that not fighting is just about the WORST thing he could possibly do and decides to change his tune, but NO!!!… he goes right back to his defeatist, "I'm doomed, there's no point in fighting so just drop it already Sam" attitude, and I'm left with a feeling that the entire episode was a complete waste of time.

3. COLE THE HERO WORSHIPPER: Geez. There was a discussion not so long ago on the preview articles that Cole was never going to say sorry for anything, not to Dean for trying to kill him and not to Sam for torturing him, because that's not the Supernatural way. Well, I guess half of us were right, Sam not only didn't get an apology, he got zero acknowledgment from Cole that they had ever even met before let alone that Cole spent a day torturing Sam for information on his brother. So, now Cole and Sam are besets buddies, I mean, weren't they FRIENDLY? Cole called Sam Sammy, just like the good and familiar friends that they are. And did Cole remember that he tortured Sam? Nope. And did Cole remember that Sam kept telling him to go back to his family (as much as four separate times in three different episodes?) Nope, even though that's exactly what Cole decided to do at the end of the ep, because you know, family is important and stuff. And best of all? We got Sam apologizing to Cole for killing his besest buddy….Kit, whom I neither liked nor cared about. Would it have killed anyone to acknowledge that Cole TORTURED Sam? Especially in light of the fact that Cole was practically falling all over himself in his unbridled adoration of hero Dean? So, only Dean gets the acknowledgement that he had any past connection with Cole; only Dean gets a thank you for his good advice and saving Coles life as though Sam hadn't saved Cole from Dean in an earlier episode and was the one to impress on Cole repeatedly the importance of family. What. In. The. Hell. Is. Going. On? Only Dean has a history? Only Dean has a past connection with other characters? Cole was practically THANKING Dean for killing his father. The character bias is nauseating.

4. POV: Dean gets lots of POV again, and a nice connection to Cole and gets to be Daddy Winchester, dispensing advice and his "never give up" attitude that he doesn't even believe in. And Sam, well at least he got a line or two and some "innuendo" in some of his one liners with the wife…. I mean are we supposed to be reading into his lines here? It seemed like they wanted us to, but there must be some kind of subtext for that to happen with any kind of effectiveness and there wasn't any, not really because Sam has no character traits left for there to be subtext for. Did we learn anything about Sam? What his plans are? What he feels about Dean's predicament? How did killing the husband reflect back on Dean's situation for Sam? It didn't, not in any obvious way, unless you do all the work yourself. Why wasn't there a scene with Sam and the widow, after Sam killed the husband, where they TALKED? Dean and Cole got to talk in the aftermath? Why not Sam and the Widow? Because no one cares about the widow, no one cares about Kit, so anything they might say is irrelevant, so why bother. But Cole is now an well fleshed out secondary character, we'll be seeing him again; lets have Dean CONNECT… let's have them discuss things relevant to both their characters. Cole was WAY more fleshed out here, had more lines and more insight than Sam has had in the past three episodes combined.

5. PLOT WRITING 101: There was something incredibly basic and almost student-like about this episode. I felt like I was watching a project by a talented novice who was still learning the basics of drama writing and was falling into the traps of over obvious dialog, contrived plot movement, obvious and rather corse character development (Sam - silent, moody; Dean -stoic, hero… yawn). There were some good visuals and a very nicely creepy atmosphere, but quite frankly I put that down to the veteran director John Badham, the acting, lighting, sets etc... and not to the script. I think Jenny Klein shows promise, but this was student level stuff, not complex enough to be considered in the same league as Robert Berens that's for sure.

6. THE MoC: Well? What about it? Was it addressed? Was the momentum, the danger, the crisis of Executioners Song followed up on in any way at all? Is the story advanced from that place to a new place with an increase of tension? (cause that's what's supposed to happen; see season 4). No, no and hell no. We are back to mopey, 'I'm doomed', Dean and his passive, "don't' look" attitude that makes zero sense, and once again he seems in perfect control of the mark and it's affects. We are back to ground zero and in a sense have returned to Season 9, First Born status; Dean is exactly the way he was when he first took on the mark and apparently killing Cain meant nothing at all. Not one single moment in this episode reflected Sam's fear that Dean was no longer himself, or that he was "in trouble" or that he's gone off the rails, or Dean's fear that he had crossed some kind of line that he couldn't go back from….. all rather dire things established in Executioners Song. Dean was his normal, cool, collected pessimistic self. The entire MoC plot thread is cyclical, moving back on itself whenever it's convenient for the writers to halt the forward movement of the plot because maybe a previous episode created too much tension or danger for the next writer to handle. So instead of capitalizing on the story elements that are already in place, this episode ignores all of the events in Executioners Song to bring us back to a static place we've seen over and over and OVER again. This is incredibly poor planning, incredibly poor season long plotting and a total waste of a good idea and a good actor in Jensen (yes, Jared is absolutely being wasted too, but that's a bigger argument for another time and well covered ground). So this episode gets bad marks from me simply for defusing the wonderfulness that was Executioners Song and returning us the the doldrums known as the MoC, or the longest running plot that went nowhere and said nothing.

Whew!! This was longer than I planned. Hope you were able to weed through it all!
sylvia37
# sylvia37 2015-03-19 10:03
I completely agree on most of these points. I will not rehash the Sam POV issue except to say that when Kit's wife said "who are you" to Sam, I said out loud to my TV, "Who Cares? The writers don't, nobody does apparently." Sigh.....anyway , I was really disturbed by the first killing. It just seemed so brutal and HUMAN I guess. Not monstery (?) And I seriously wanted Sam to punch Cole every time he called him Sammy. Ugh...it was so jarring and just ugh....

So questions:

1. It does appear that Sam will be keeping his research a secret. I hope this means that he will be looking up some really nefarious stuff and that we get to actually SEE him acting on it.

2. I have no idea what's up with Dean. As E said, one minute he's moping, then next he's all "you are not giving up" to Cole. He's all over the place all though I suppose this "do what I say, not what I do" attitude is pretty typical of Dean. Remember "what's dead should stay dead" as he sells his soul to bring his brother back to life? Where's the eyeroll emoticon?

3. The anvils were flying at the end there, but I can't decide if we're headed for Dean killing Sam ala Cain and Abel or Sam having to kill Dean because "sometimes you can't save the guy". Once again, they've sort of been all over the place with this stuff. Keeping us guessing I suppose.

All in all, it was an okay episode. I was kind of irritated that they split up again, but I'm glad Sam saved the wife because that would just have been horrible. I do wish , as stated above, that Cole would at least acknowledge that he tortured Sam, or that Big Brother would have said something about it. But Sam was his usual compassionate self, which is great and all, but it would have been nice to see someone being compassionate back or at least acknowledging that it wasn't okay. And no more nicknames.....j ust no.
E
# E 2015-03-19 10:47
Hi Sylvia37… ah well, I guess we are in the minority on this one. That's not unusual for me. I agree with you about Dean. Exactly what is his stance? That you have to fight? or you have to give up? I guess you have to fight unless you're Dean, then you can give up. Oh, but wait, Dean is demanding that Sam give up too, so I guess you fight unless you're Dean or you're Sam and have been dictated to by Dean. Now, I could understand it if Dean was conflicted; he's not in a good place… but that's not how it's being written. Dean is being written as begin a noble mentor when telling Cole to fight and then he's being nobly realistic in giving up on himself. The show is trying to cut it both ways and it's not working. Both of those attitudes can't be opposing each other in the same character and both be the right attitude, but that's exactly what we are getting.

And yeah… the nicknames?!?! WTF? Sammy? DEAN-O… just NO-O as in never again. It was so forced friendly "I'm your friend, I'm your bro… Dean-O". Yuck.

And I have ZERO problem with Sam keeping his research a secret; after all Dean is keeping his 'you'll kill your brother" convo with Cain a secret too, so why shouldn't Sam do what he has to seeing as how his brother is in "lets ignore it until it goes away" mode? Its funny, the only secret keeping that we are hearing about appears to be Sam not telling Dean he's still looking for a cure and no one is commenting on the whopper Dean is keeping. Again with the double standard.
anonymousN
# anonymousN 2015-03-19 10:55
Quote:
Sammy?
I am seething.
Dean-O who cares Dean-O is a Mean-O
E
# E 2015-03-19 21:43
Hah!!! anonymous!! I guffawed out loud. :D
LEAH
# LEAH 2015-03-19 17:38
I wasn't crazy about the Dean-o thing when Meg did it, then it sort of became her thing. Honestly I don't dislike Travis but I have never bought this tough guy/smart ass character. I don't believe he can carry a spin off. Cole is just ahead of Garth in his intimidating ability :) Now Tahmoh I would have bought in that part. Poor Sam he looks like he could use some vitamins and some sun. :(
E
# E 2015-03-19 21:46
At least when Meg did it we were supposed to be affronted by it… Dean-O is demeaning somehow. But when Cole said it, somehow it was supposed to be… I don't even know… friendly? And it just wasn't. Cole can keep his Sammy's and his Dean-O's to himself. I am not really buying his "tough guy" act either. I think he'd have been better served being a bit more sensitive and less mouthy. I really didn't like him for much of this episode; he was off putting, disrespectful and defensive. I can understand why he might be with Dean, but it didn't ring true to me for some reason. By the end of the ep, I was thawing out a bit, but by that time Cole had dropped the show.
E
# E 2015-03-19 10:51
Quote:
I do wish , as stated above, that Cole would at least acknowledge that he tortured Sam, or that Big Brother would have said something about it. But Sam was his usual compassionate self, which is great and all, but it would have been nice to see someone being compassionate back or at least acknowledging that it wasn't okay
OH! And I forgot to mention; in my mind there is a HUGE difference between compassionate and door matt… and that's what Sam has become, a door matt; step all over him, no one even remembers that they left all their dirt all over him.
percysowner
# percysowner 2015-03-19 17:30
. The anvils were flying at the end there, but I can't decide if we're headed for Dean killing Sam ala Cain and Abel or Sam having to kill Dean because "sometimes you can't save the guy". Once again, they've sort of been all over the place with this stuff. Keeping us guessing I suppose.

Well they established last season that Dean can't be killed without popping back up as a demon. Now, mind you, this is canon and this crew is really BAD at upholding canon, but this is canon written during the Carver years. So Sam killing Dean shouldn't be an option or at least not a permanent option. Sam may not know this, however, so he may "kill" Dean only to have Dean turn demon and then kill Sam. I guess that's one way for both guys to die at the end of a season.
sylvia37
# sylvia37 2015-03-19 18:06
Well having them both die at the end of a season is a slightly new twist from having one or the other die I suppose, ;). Someone else pointed out on another site about Dean not being able to die, so I knew that, but as you said, canon in this era is apparently written in disappearing ink so who knows if they've even thought of that. I just want SOMETHING interesting to happen and my Pollyanna is still hoping it happens to Sam.
Jo1027
# Jo1027 2015-03-19 15:32
Yes, to everything you said. There is nothing more to add, you said it so well. Thank you.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 16:13
E, I actually agree with every point you made, but for me the episode was good because at least it was an interesting story, I do like Cole as character other than what you pointed out regarding his attitudes toward Sam and Dean in your point number 3 (and I was anticipating Sam telling Cole not to call him Sammy!), and it seemed a cut above most of the episodes we've seen these last few months. I guess my favorable review is partly the result of massively reduced expectations. I'm trying really hard to find things to like, or at least not to hate, in each ep. That said, I wholeheartedly concur about the ongoing travesty of how Sam is written, but again, this ep seemed slightly better. Sam was never tied up and he killed the monster and saved the woman, so right there this was better than most episodes lately. Like you, I thought it was ridiculous that he said NOT ONE WORD after Dean's monologue in the car. I was literally leaning forward waiting to hear him tear into Dean about giving up, which is a completely illogical attitude by Dean for all of the reasons you stated. Especially because of what Cain said to Dean about killing Sam, although Sam may not be aware of that. I'm pretty sure that's one secret Dean is keeping. But most of all, I'm desperately hoping that the long-awaited Sam arc is about to begin, so that last scene felt like a lifeline. Sure there's a good chance I'll hate the way his arc unfolds, but hope springs eternal. Actually, as I'm writing this I thought of one other thing that really bothered me about the ep. Instead of smart Sam figuring out the dehydration cure, it was Dean and Cole (!) the neophyte hunter who did so. They really are stripping Sam of almost all of his outstanding character traits and I hate it. I also hated Sam's hair with a passion- it just added insult to injury regarding his characterizatio n. I don't know if you saw it, but in Alice's new thread on the Discussion pages Jen posted a link to an article about what has happened to Sam's character, and after almost every point by the author I was nodding my head. It was an excellent analysis.
E
# E 2015-03-19 21:57
I did see that article and I thought it was very well written and completely accurate; Sam is indeed begin "flattened" as a character; all of his established attributes are slowly being dissolved one by one until he's a shadow of a man. Or as someone so accurately said on another thread, Sam is a cypher, who's sole purpose is to reflect back on Dean, and has no qualities, ideas, needs, wants of his own. That's why they don't have him speak, or interact or show his reactions to things, because he's of no importance beyond how he influences Dean's behavior, which we get in excruciating and endless detail.
Ginger
# Ginger 2015-03-19 10:42
For a standard stand-alone MotW episode, I liked it. Thanks, Klein, for remembering the horror element of the show. This episode is one of three from the season I would re-watch (Reichenbach and Executioner's Song being the other two).

I can take or leave Cole. I am not warming up to Cole's character, although I recognize Klein tried to do some rehabilitating here. With the line, "I hope never to see you again," I think we are pretty assured of seeing lots of the character in the future. Fortunately, he is NOT Charlie and he is not a teenager, so the character does not annoy me. I find the actor's inexperience shows a bit; that he tries just a little too hard, and I don't see a lot of charisma in him, but he is definitely better than most all of the recurrings.

I think it's a little late in the season to still be reinforcing to the audience the question of "Can Sam save Dean or will Dean save himself" so pointedly, but it is what it is. Really liked Badham's direction. There were some beautiful shots of the Impala.

I really liked that Klein had Dean not fawning over Cole and not hating on him. He was just another person Dean had run into before and, as such, Dean played things close to his chest. I like Klein remembered that about Dean's character.

The worst part of the episode was Sam's hairdo. The medium length man-bob is terrible. Dear Chuck, get a new hairdresser on set, please.

All-in-all, considering what huge potential S10 offered in the beginning and how much that potential has been squandered, I rather appreciate Klein remembered SPN is a horror genre show, and I liked this episode.
sylvia37
# sylvia37 2015-03-19 11:43
Oh God yes, for the love of Chuck, please someone fire those hairdressers. Seriously, just let Jared do his own hair. He'll put a beanie on, pull it off, run his hand through it, and voila! Perfect! Are these the same people from season 7 with the horrible sideburns because they should have been canned ages ago.
cheryl42
# cheryl42 2015-03-19 12:29
You mean like this? https://38.media.tumblr.com/ba0f9752b0d00944436dabedd971161d/tumblr_nlfgjuS5Bd1sk69ewo1_540.gif
sylvia37
# sylvia37 2015-03-19 14:55
Haha..... exactly like that. :)
E
# E 2015-03-19 22:08
Agreed about Sam's hair… what is with the 1990's teenage girl look? It's emasculating him! He's starting to look like Blossom, all he needs is a hat with a flower on it and some bangs. For crying out loud, let the guy cut his hair…

IMO the writers didn't need to have Dean be all buddy-buddy with Cole; Cole as capable of epic fawning all by himself. His hero-worship was obvious and nauseating.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-20 14:13
Darn it E, now I can't stop picturing Sam wearing the Blossom hat. I wonder if there's some way they could work that into a future episode. Maybe he could be required to go incognito as a girl.
E
# E 2015-03-20 18:01
Nah… they just need to start an episode with a montage of Sam popping up into frame in all sorts of cute outfits and floppy hats. Maybe he could do a few cartwheels to peppy music.
anonymousN
# anonymousN 2015-03-19 10:46
Quote:
Dean and Cole share a nice emotional moment about Cole’s father and giving up.
I have not watched the episode so did it happen when all the tension ended and the job was done.because if not then it was not a heart to heart. Dean and Cole could not have a heart to heart .WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA:(
I am so glad that Sam had heart to heart with cole by apologizing to him.It seems Sam has stolckholm syndrome by such small torture session he must absolutely possitively support,empathi ze,sympathize with Lucifer.such wonderful times Sam had in hell thanks to Lucifer."Sorry Lucifer for trapping your brother in hell" said Sam the seriel stolckholm syndrome guy.
cheryl42
# cheryl42 2015-03-19 10:52
Did anyone see what Sam was researching just before Dean walked in?
njspnfan
# njspnfan 2015-03-19 11:08
Hi Cheryl42 - the first site was Biblical and Far-East Studies, with a picture of what appears to be Cain killing Abel, then a second page on the same website with information about the Mark of Cain
cheryl42
# cheryl42 2015-03-19 12:30
Thanks it happened too fast for me to make out.
njspnfan
# njspnfan 2015-03-19 11:11
That was the director John Badham walking in front of the house Sam and Dean went to right after the police station scene, about 6-7 minutes in to the episode.
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-19 11:25
LOVE YOUR INSIGHTS
dude :P
Daisymae
# Daisymae 2015-03-19 11:57
I think TPTB are contemplating using Cole in the spin off, and this was an audition; I think he passed.
E
# E 2015-03-20 08:14
A spinoff with Cole will work about as well as Bloodlines. He's not a likable enough character to hold a whole show by himself. I am continually stunned that any potential spinoff does not surround Jody and Donna… well liked, well established characters with a built in fan base. Sometimes TPTB are too young, too male and too money oriented to see what's right under their noses.
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-19 12:01
COLE was petit an young.
IRL he is older than JENSEN.
ThisOldBag
# ThisOldBag 2015-03-19 14:07
Yeah, using a 38 year old to play a 24 year old is fine for a while, but normal aging will make a long series implausible. However, this genre allows for creative explaining in that department. I'd actually like to see something unique in a spin off show.

I was hoping there would be a purpose to Cole but I've not seen that yet.

And kudos to JP for raising the bar on brilliant acting without dialog.

The real problem with Sam keeping his research a secret is that there is no 'story' behind it, therefore no reason to not just say "you freaking idiot! If you go dark or die again, you'll end up being the unkillable godlike scourge of the earth and we will all die. So suck it up and let's figure it out, like we always do."

Jenny Klein is normally not bad with giving Sam a voice, so I have to assume this directive to silence Sam comes from the top. I would then have to assume that there is a planned "big reveal" that will explain what's happening/happe ned with Sam. However, at this point it's all about the delivery and pacing, which is really 'off' but typical of the Carver years.

Although I refuse to get my hopes up and I refuse to upset myself when my expectations are kicked in the jewels again, but "horror" is not gore. I know Jenny likes gore, she's made no secret of that, but gore to me, has never been the same as horror. No fear=not horror.

My biggie, however, is Sam wanting to be able to save a monster? Really? I know he's always been a bit like that, but lately he's been willing to shove a demon back into an innocent victim in order to kill them both, and NOW he's lamenting? Really? Just too much.

I think I need to rewatch and ff thru the "gore" as I may have been somewhat distracted from the story. But first watch I'll give it a C.

And, thanks E, love your comment!
percysowner
# percysowner 2015-03-19 17:42
so I have to assume this directive to silence Sam comes from the top. I would then have to assume that there is a planned "big reveal" that will explain what's happening/happe ned with Sam

If history under Carver holds, said "big reveal" will be 2 lines in the finale, followed by Dean having monologues galore.

I'd have more hope about Sam's story if they didn't take the entire previouslies to "remind" us that Sam is a brain dead idiot who has never come up with a plan and says "I don't know" whenever questioned about a case or a problem. Then having Dean come up with the idea to save Cole and having Sam just sit around watching Kit until he knew if if worked instead of saying "let's give it a try" further accentuated the brain dead idiot Sam motif.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 17:55
You're right about the previouslies. I'd forgotten about it til I read your comment, but what the hell was that about? Smart Sam is clearly a relic of the distant past and it ticks me off no end. That was one of his defining qualities the first few years. Even as recently as season 8 Dean was acknowledging that Sam was the brains of the operation. Now apparently everyone is smarter than Sam. It must be a result of all of those blows to the head he's suffered.
E
# E 2015-03-19 22:11
Quote:
And kudos to JP for raising the bar on brilliant acting without dialog.
Yes… he's a mime now.
E
# E 2015-03-19 22:33
Quote:
and NOW he's lamenting? Really? Just too much
Yeah TOB.. I hear you. This episode seemed to be chock full of "influences." Dean influences Cole, killing the victim of the week influences Sam etc.. But I agree with you. With all the things Sam has been through and all the people he's had to kill, he's going to be somehow motivated to save Dean because he couldn't save this guy? This Kit, whom we only saw on screen a handful of times and had no dialog? It's such weak plotting! Maybe if the writers/PTB/Dir ectors/et al had even spent one minute on having Sam actually talk to Kit, try and get him to fight the Kahn Worm, discuss his pain and have Sam relate… but no! Kit was just your run of the mill monster who'd gone round the bend and Sam had to kill him like he has so many other times before and not even blinked an eye. Why does this guy's death bother Sam so much? They did not lay down the proper foundation for Sam's motivation, so I couldn't buy into it at all. Why not have Sam connect to the guy, talk to him so that we, the viewers could see them connect, so that we the viewers could see Sam begin to care, so that we could care too? Because they had to waste 2/3 of the episode on Dean and Cole and their bonding sessions, that's why. Because when it comes down to showing what's motivating Sam vs. what's motivating Dean there's no contest and Sam is always the looser. I mean, we didn't even get to see Sam kill Kit so how are we supposed to be affected by Kit's death and see Sam affected by it, or believe that it mattered enough to Sam to motivate him into whatever he's going to do for Dean? So instead of spending any real time on showing the event that may very well have pushed Sam onto a dark path, we instead spend about 65% of the episode on watching Dean save Cole and NOT be affected in any way by Cole's predicament or Cole's willingness to fight or his victory over the Kahn Worm. So, they ignore the active plot; the plot that is FINALLY seeing some kind of development after over a year of nothing at all to instead pour attention and needlessly unnecessary detail all over the plot that's going absolutely nowhere. Yeah… that makes sense.
Glorie
# Glorie 2015-03-19 14:42
I did enjoy the episode quite a bit, but there were a few irritating things that stood out to me:

Sam gets hit and falls down--AGAIN? That has got to stop. It's unreal. The guy is huge. This makes him wimpy.
Yes, both Kit and Cole should have been tied up better. Really, guys.
Sam's hair? WTF? It's sooooo girly it's distracting. It makes me wince.
This episode was an excellent opportunity to have Dean take some damn clothes off. The sweating scenes with Cole? Dean looked stupid in multiple layers of clothes. Oh. He did push up his sleeves.

But, the episode did have my son and I screaming at the grossness of the worm. We both agreed it kept our attention all the way through.
cheryl42
# cheryl42 2015-03-19 15:13
Quote:
This episode was an excellent opportunity to have Dean take some damn clothes off
My thoughts exactly. What the Heck. Jensen is too pretty to cover up anyway and....come on the scene was begging for it.:o
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 16:07
I enjoyed this for the MOTW episode it was but was hoping for some follow through on the MOC. At this point Dean doesn't seem to be having any effects from it. It's just a tattoo. I see this dragging on into S11 unfortunately.

I'm not a big fan of Cole but he was less annoying in this episode. Sammy and Dean-O!! What happened to the Sam who told anyone other then Dean not to call him Sammy? I, like some others have mentioned, think they are grooming Cole for some sort of spin off. Goodbye to his family.

Glad Sam got to save the damsel in distress and not be one. Hated Sam's hair. Wondered why we are the only show on TV with two hunky guys who are rarely in less then 2 layers of clothes. Surprised Dean didn't still have his coat on! WTH!

It was definitely an unusually gross episode. Even Dean squashing ithe khan worm with his boot was icky! Hope he wiped it off before he got into Baby. I always wonder who gets to clean up the mess they make? Are we to infer that they have when they are shown packing up the car later? I also wonder how their suits are so perfectly pressed when they pack up their stuff in duffle bags? Inquiring minds need to know. Lol.
ThisOldBag
# ThisOldBag 2015-03-19 17:42
It's "supernatural"! Pressed suits, wifi everywhere, grave digging and site cleanup in minutes! And plenty of mousse! Actually, I rarely notice Sam's hair. I love Sam but he can go Dean-cut anytime, or should I say "not Moose" cut. Oddly "not Moose" wears more mousse than "Moose". Sometimes I think Dean could use that helmet coif as a weapon.
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 18:45
Lol!!!
percysowner
# percysowner 2015-03-19 17:44
Since they were very careful to NOT show Sam killing Kit, I'm not 100% sure he did and that the wife didn't save our Samsel in distress. She is going with the story that Kit went nuts and she killed him, so there is some chance that it is exactly what happened.
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 18:43
I haven't re watched but it looked like Sam had the gun in his hand, so until I hear different from the show, I'm going with Sam killed Kit and Jemma made up her part to satisfy the police. Maybe they cut the actual shot for time? Why do you think Sam may not have? Maybe we weren't supposed to know the outcome until Dean called?
percysowner
# percysowner 2015-03-19 21:07
I must have been somewhat distracted in that scene because I forgot Sam actually got the gun. I remembered him dropping it and the mad scramble. Plus he said he killed KIt because Kit was going to kill Jenna, but Kit was actually trying to kill him at the time, so it just seemed off. I am sure they cut from the scene so we would wonder if Sam killed him or waited to see if Dean's cure worked.
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 21:39
Thanks. I was just curious about whether you had caught something I had missed. My husband and I both thought it was odd at the time that we didn't hear any gun shot. We thought at first Sam may have just knocked him out.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 17:46
"It's just a tattoo"- priceless. Also, regarding the clothing layers, my daughter and I are always wondering just how cold it is in Vancouver. Even in the episodes that were filmed in the summer, Sam and Dean are rarely wearing fewer than two layers, and more often it's three layers. I feel like re-watching the whole series just to see if they've ever hit the elusive "four layer" episode. In ten years I think they've only been seen in short sleeves around 10 times. Not that I watch the show for the beefcake (well, not PRIMARILY ), but an occasional glimpse would not be unpleasant. How's that for incisive analysis?
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 18:54
I do remember occasionally in the early days they slept in boxer shorts and t-shirts but now they even sleep fully clothed. I'm just saying for realism's sake of course, cause none of us are about the beefcake (not primarily). Hell, Dean slept in pajama bottoms with Lisa! There was "The Slice Girls" though. Lol
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 07:46
You gotta feel for those guys tho! Shooting in the cold like that but the heat would be worse! I remember reading where Jensen was talking about the scene that Jared and he shot where they were walking in the hospital parking lot after Gadreel had taken over Sam in order to heal him. Jensen said how miserably hot it was and if you will notice they are still in their normal three layers. I know the sleeves are cut off of the undergarmets but still could you imagine having to do that on a searingly hot day in July? I start sweating the minute it just barely starts getting warm... course I don't get paid thousands of dollars for my discomfort...
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 07:35
Well Prix, Jensen did give ushis packing secret to avoid wrinkles. Roll them. This also affords you much more room to pack and I can attest to the fact that it works. So thats how Dean does it in my mind. Ha!

I think they are both begrudgingly allowing the nicknames out of respect to Coles military service as well as to his past and now present supernatural background... and its Dean-o and SammyBOY - maybe thats why Sams not saying anything. :) I like it. Its cocky and borders on him saying he's listening but not taking their ****. Plus its a military thing and I think they get that too. And what did Dean call him? Kung Fu grip?!? Ha!

I really like Travis and the character he's creating in Cole but I don't see spinoff with him any more than I do Donna and Jodi. They aren't the age CW wants. I believe Kim even said that when someone tweeted asking her about it. It's sad to say that the CW can be so short sighted but it's true. Personally, I don't see any spinoff working from Supernatural. Supernatural is Jensen and Jared. That's it, that's how its been and it always will be. Without them? I'm gone. The only way I would stick around is if I saw stellar writing, but they would probably just hand it over to some of the present crew and if so, no thanks. But that's just me.
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-20 14:21
It could be the finest writing in the history of writing and I still wouldn't stick around if either or both of the Js left. To me, SPN is the brothers, pure and simple. I'm stubborn that way. When Star Trek TNG came on the air I wouldn't even give it a chance because for me, ST was Kirk, Spock and Bones and I didn't want to see any other crew on board the Enterprise. How dare Picard try to fill Kirk's shoes! See, I still resent it all these years later. As I reread my comment, it becomes increasingly clear to me that I might be in need of therapy.:)
YellowEyedSam
# YellowEyedSam 2015-03-19 19:29
Finally, some hint Sam may go to dangerous lengths to save his brother. It had better be worth the wait as many others have said "Sam is in the background, silent or getting his butt kicked".

I'll forgive the writers if it leads to what I enjoy: Sam going dark side. I have a thing for pure characters going evil haha.
percysowner
# percysowner 2015-03-19 21:29
I understand but I'm sick to death of Sam ALWAYS being the one to "go dark" while Dean stay lily white and pure. He allies with the bestest most honorable vampire ever and even when that vampire kills another hunter and friend, we are told that it was the hunter's fault. He takes the MOC and only kills bad guys. He becomes a demon treats women better than many guys (see Lester), only kills demons, protects his girlfriend from an abusive ex and saves a lady from being murdered by murdering her husband (Lester). I want Dean to actually do bad things without immediately getting the oh, so sympathetic edit while the people he hurts, mostly Sam, are either written off the show or silenced (Sam). If Sam goes dark I'm 99% sure that ALL we will ever hear is HOW HARD IT IS FOR DEAN and Sam's feelings when he makes his dark decisions will be never spoken of.
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-19 21:56
I agree, Percy. We have seen Sam go dark too many times. It would be ridiculous if they try to make Sam darker then Dean with the MOC. What I'm hoping for is Sam coming up with a solution to the mark. That Metatron actually does know something and as dark as Sam gets is wounding Metatron when Cas tells him to shoot him and Metatron squeals like a pig and gives up what he knows.

If we get another finale where one of the brothers dies or nearly dies, yet again, you will hear my screams all over the state of Ohio. Please, something new and original.

I know JC said we would question who was darker but I think he says stuff in interviews he thinks sounds good and then forgets what he said and doesn't follow through because he pretty much wings the whole season.
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 07:56
Prix - You are giving Jeremy Carver way too much in the way of benefit of the doubt that he even KNOWS that he is being interviewed let alone what planet the man is standing on! ;)

Percy - What did you expect Benny to do, just let Martin kill him? It's not like Dean didn't warn him...
Barbara Maake
# Barbara Maake 2015-03-19 23:08
On the one hand I agree that it will be nauseating to see Sam go dark and have blame and accusations piled on him by Dean and everyone else. On the other hand, it will almost be worth it if while he's dark, he is given a spine and lays into Dean for all the crap Dean has pulled the past couple of seasons. One of the joys of Soulless Sam was that he didn't take crap from anyone, he never let Dean boss him around, he was smart and he took initiative. Sam has become so passive and so deferential to Dean that I can't stand it. He's almost unrecognizable as season 1-4 Sam. And truthfully, passive Sam has thrown off the brotherly dynamic and made Dean less likeable as well. Dean has always been the bossy big brother, but now without a dynamic Sam to rein him in, he often comes off as an arrogant dictator.
PaintedWolf
# PaintedWolf 2015-03-20 01:48
First off, sorry if I repeat anything. I always leave my initial comments before reading any others.
Y’know, I feel like I’ve been saying this after every episode I’ve liked lately-and maybe it’s just because I’m an old hand who’s been watching since the beginning- but I still maintain Supernatural is at its best when it’s just Sam and Dean in the bunker or on the road doing their thing. So, yeah. I liked this episode. I thought it maybe started off a tiny bit slow, but by the end I was enjoying it quite a bit. I suppose that’s the novelty of having characters I actually care about. I like Cole. He’s one of those tough, take-no-crap kind of guys, which is probably why he gets on so well with the Winchesters. I also liked how he kept calling them Sammy and Deano (I’ve been calling them that for years), and I found myself sitting there at one point thinking “Don’t you dare kill him off, Show!”
I also liked the call-back to Eve and the Khan worm (continuity!), and the way they didn’t actually show us Sam having to kill Kit. The way we saw him grab the gun, and then it cut to his wife holding him, I thought it was subtle way to show us, in this story at least, that Kit wasn’t just a monster to be killed. Which brings me to our beloved Sammy. Is it just me, or do we have a reason to be kind of (really) worried about him? He took their (his) loss this time really hard, and seems to be taking this MOC situation a hell of a lot worse than Dean. He just looked so tired and lost at the end there, I really wanted to give him a hug.
I’m still all for a win in the Sam-saves-Dean column, but I’m kind of concerned about the effect this all might be having on him in the long run. Or am I just being paranoid?
Final random thought:
Did I read it right that the place they stopped to eat at was called Sammy’s?
MK
# MK 2015-03-20 03:39
Do you think Sam will give up his quest or keep it secret from Dean? Considering the last two and a half seasons, the backstory to the MOC, and no supportive POV for Sam or his side of the story at all, this is a ‘quest’ that Sam is almost destined to fail. This episode highlighted that, and showed that Dean is most likely to save himself. Plus, Dean now knows that Sam is researching, they spend pretty much 24 hours a day together, Sam isn’t allowed to just take off in the car, so it’s not as if he'll will be able to keep it a secret.

Do you think Dean means that he’s just given up on finding a cure? Dean was never that interested in finding a cure in the first place.

Do you think Jemma/Kit signaled what will happen with Sam/Dean? No. There were signals or parallels about the problems in their relationship all last season and nothing conclusive came of any of them. There have been many different signals about a possible end result with the MOC this season so I don’t expect anything conclusive here either.

What we are possibly looking at now as an end game this season is that Sam will go ‘dark’ (aka Sam will do something Dean doesn’t approve of) and Dean won’t kill him for it. That alone will differentiate him from Cain and by that act, the mark will be gone. Dean will have overcome the mark by ‘love’ and he can then spend the next season ticked at Sam, not trusting him and basically punishing him for what Sam was willing to do to save him.

Other thoughts The to and froing by both Sam and Dean is getting more confusing and harder to take with each passing episode. For seasons Dean has lambasted Sam for what he has perceived as Sam ‘giving up’ (going to college, wanting normal, wanting out of hunting, not wanting deals made for his life). Now he wants him to give up on Dean, something made all the harder to take when you consider Dean’s extreme reaction in season 8 when he perceived that Sam ‘gave up’ on him.

I’m glad people weren’t expecting an apology from Cole for torturing Sam. Interesting that both he and Dean got an apology, though.

Sam should feel bad for what happened to Kit, because he did absolutely nothing to try and save him. Instead he just sat passively around and waited for Dean to come up with a cure; another recurring theme throughout Carvers reign.

Two of the few remaining threads that linked Supernatural to Carver’s Supernatural are now gone. Dean was the only one who got to call Sam ‘Sammy’, but Cole did in this episode. And Dean would threaten anyone who hurt Sam, but he’s bffing with Cole after Cole tortured Sam. Perhaps now that they need to keep Castiel and Dean apart, there’s room for a new brother for Dean and Cole will slot right in. Though perhaps they are just priming Cole to be the main character in the spin off and so made him into Dean Winchester II, right down to the clothes, the hair, the nicknames, the arrogance, the attitude and the backstory. If you add in him not thinking enough of other characters to apologise when he hurts them, then he’s a cardboard cutout of Dean

The irony of the monster being a Khan worm knockoff was beautiful, especially considering how critical Jeremy Carver has been of the storylines they had under Sera Gamble!

All in all, a middling to poor episode. C-
Prix68
# Prix68 2015-03-20 06:21
This is the problem for me with the Carver years. The inconsistency. In the Executioner's Song Dean says if he comes out of the barn a monster they should take him out. No one acts like that is impossible. Same thing when Dean tells Cas to kill him if he becomes a demon again. Cas doesn't say it's not possible. So even though it would seem to be impossible from last year's finale, it doesn't seem like that is the case this year.

Also Sam researching secretly seems like "drama" for the sake of drama because it was Sam who originally chided Dean for holing up in the bunker doing endless research when they had already researched everything. Sam, at that point, actually encouraged Dean to do what he is doing, their job and to fight the urges of the mark. So I don't see this as Dean giving up so much as him doing what he can do best until that can't be done anymore. He'll keep on fighting until he can't any more. Dean obviously realizes he can't be allowed to be a dangerous demon. He would need to be killed. The only reason I can think of for Sam to keep his research secret is because he's not looking for a cure but a way to kill Dean.

Things waffle so much from episode to episode and season to season with Carver that it's almost impossible to follow threads to some sort of logical conclusion. JMO
AlyCat22
# AlyCat22 2015-03-20 08:10
Dean also knows he can't be killed. When push shoves and it's getting to the point where Dean thinks he's a danger to them all, I think he is just figuring on leaving like he did last time. If they can figure out a way to kill him, fine, but I think he took Cains words that there is no cure to heart. His only cure died at the edge of the First Blade and he knows that now. Its not what he wants, he just doesn't see anyway out and wants the time left to be him and Sammy doing what they do best.
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-22 21:50
Has anyone noticed that only Dean and Cole call Sam, ''SAMMY or SAMMY BOY'' ;)
Russ
# Russ 2015-03-23 02:19
I was waiting for the "only he gets to call me that".
anonymousN
# anonymousN 2015-03-23 04:06
All things that matter to sam more do not matter to the show runners ..but let Sam put an I pod jack in the car (I do not call it baby It is the car to me) ohhh noooo.
NOLANOLA
# NOLANOLA 2015-03-23 04:31
Russ, wondering what you would like to see as a spin-off AND what do you expect to see. thx.